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Re: Any thoughts on IR and if I need further testing??

From: Barb (anonymous@obgyn.net)
Sun, 22 Sep 2002 18:25:48 -0500 (CDT)


Pat,

Why would a five hour Igtt not be advised.You mention GTT. I thought it was the five hour glucose with simultaneous insulin levels that are tested? And what is the glucose challenge?Sorry for the questions ,I had a few tests already and am confused.Just had the IGTT done and they want another one.

As for the thyroid meds...here is an article that I have..my cousin has IR and thyroid disease and was told that not taking thyroid meds screw up his insulin levels. A secondary cautionary note to mention is that there is now recognized in the literature a 'thyroid resistance syndrome' similar in character to 'insulin resistance'. This manifests as symptoms of low thyroid function but normal thyroid blood work. An imbalance of omega-3/omega-6 fatty acids can contribute to this condition. Lowering omega-6 fats and dramatically increasing omega-3 (fish oil NOT flax) has improved or normalized thyroid function in some persons.

In addition lithium orotate, as mentioned in the supplement list to follow, has been very successful in reversing this syndrome in some persons. The dose used is very low (120 mg of lithium orotate containing 4.8 mg of lithium), not anywhere near the dose used by physicians to treat bi-polar disorders (800-2400 mg of lithium carbonate daily). In 'resistance syndrome' lithium is being used as a trace element, currently recognized as conditionally essential, to restore membrane sensitivity. This information is from the work of Hans A.Neiper , M.D. More information is available from the Brewer Science Library.

If you decide to try lithium use only the orotate and use only a small dose such as the one suggested below or less. More is not better. There is some evidence that low dose lithium may also restore membrane sensitivity to glucose and insulin in hypoglycemics and diabetics.

YOUR TREATMENT PROTOCOL: Initially your doctor will ask you to increase your thyroid medication dose gradually. Your medication will usually be raised every 3-4 weeks. Do not raise your dose faster without your doctor's permission. When your thyroid's function has been impaired for an extended period of time there can be deterioration in many of the organ systems in your body, one of the most important being the heart. There may also be changes in the central nervous system. Because of these changes, increasing your dose too quickly could have serious consequences. Even though your maintenance dose may be much higher than that with which you start, INCREASE SLOWLY with your doctor's permission and monitoring. The maintenance dose, arrived at slowly, is 100-300 mcg. of Synthroid or Levothroid (T4) or 60-180 mg of Armour or Westhroid (whole thyroid). There is a great difference in these doses and blood work is always the best indicator that you have reached your ideal dose. 1 grain means about 100 mcg of Synthroid or 60 mg of Armour. 1.5 grain (150 mcg Synthroid or 90 mg Armour) is a typical maintenance dose. Dose is usually increased in increments of 25-50 mcg (15-30 mg whole thyroid) until your TSH falls within normal range.

On the correct dose of thyroid you will have stable blood sugar levels; normal appetite; energy; normal sleep patterns; no frequent urination; a basal temperature of 97.8-98.2; no hair loss; good hair texture-not coarse or fine; good circulation-warm hands and feet and the ability to warm up quickly when you get cold; good skin texture-not dry and thick or thin and oily; good skin color-normal, slightly pink without abnormal flushing-the palms of the hands and soles of the feet should not appear yellow or orange; normal size tongue-pink with no indentations around the edges; no athletes foot; good resistance to infection; normal mucous membranes-not excessive or thickened mucous; improvement or elimination of environmental and food allergies; normal perspiration patterns-not sweating without cause but having the ability to perspire when exercising or when the temperature rises; no night sweats; stable mood-not depression, having curiosity and a desire to do and to have; enjoying exercise and feeling a benefit after working out; good short and long term memory; the ability and desire to experience sexual satisfaction; a good sense of taste and smell; good reflexes-neither too fast nor to slow; no constipation or diarrhea; a normal menstrual cycle of 3-5 days without heavy bleeding and without PMS.

Your dose of thyroid is too high if: you experience undo sweating; heart palpitations; hunger-eating all the time without weight gain; a resting pulse above 80; quick movements; thin/fragile skin; a change in hair texture to very fine; a basal temperature above 98.2; eye or vision changes; headaches with no apparent reason; nervousness; tremor; unusual increase in amount and number of bowel movements per day; diarrhea. Ask your druggist for the written material available concerning your medication. Read all overdose symptoms and contraindications. The normal thyroid converts more thyroxine,T4, into T3 (the active thyroid hormone) during stress, in colder weather and when you are ill or injured. You may be able to adjust your dose, with your doctor's consent, to fit the situation. To be able to do this successfully you need a prescription for an incremental dose in addition to your regular prescription.

Thyroid hormone consists of several fractions. The most important fractions are T3 and T4. Armour contains both, Synthroid contains only T4 and Cytomel contains only T3. Some individuals appear to have a problem converting the inactive T4 found in Synthroid into the active T3 . Zinc and magnesium are required for this conversion, as well as other nutrients. Your physician can check to see if you have a problem by monitoring your free T3 levels.

Please remember your needs change with age, weather, illness and injury. What worked in the past may need adjustment today. Watch your symptoms. They are your body's way of talking to you.

>
>Okay, so you have been officially diagnosed with PCOS ? I would think
>that alone would be an indication for Metformin. What is his rationale
>for not treating you with Metformin? Are you overweight, and skipping
>periods ? At the very least, Metformin might make your cycles more
>regular, and help with weight loss. Of course, starting with a moderate
>to low carb diet and regular exercise can help also. If you are trying
>to conceive, then treatment with Metformin is certaintly within the
>range of normal management. There is an excellent article on ObGyn.net
>about screening and management for PCOS
>
>[http://www.obgyn.net/pcos/pcos.asp?page=/pcos/articles/lotfi-pcos-protocol]
>{{It is the article about Protocols}}, and on the American Association
>of Clinical Endocrinologists about Insulin Resistance and screening for
>that.
>1. http://www.aace.com/pub/BMI/press.php
>2. http://www.aace.com/pub/BMI/findings.php
>
>Perhaps you could read those, and then speak with your provider again.
>If he/she resists your requests, and has no good rationale, then move on
>to someone who will. Some folks recommend ingesting a high carb diet
>the days preceeding the FBS and 2 hour test, so that the test will show
>what the situation is if you were eating 'normally'.
>
>If you are not challeneged with a hight carb diet and insulin not
>tested, you might not have been appropriately diagnosed. YOu shouldn't
>need a 5 hour GTT, but you could try a glucose challenge, and 2 hour PP.
>But, if you have PCOS, I would assume you were IR, and proceed from
>there. It is doubtful to me that not taking your meds would affect this
>particular blood test.
>
>--
>Pat Sonnenstuhl, ARNP, CNM, MS
>PCOS Support
>Editorial Advisor PCOS Pavilion
>http://www.obgyn.net/pcos/pcos.asp
>http://www.midwivesofwa.org/pcos.htm
>http://www.midwivesofwa.org//pcosarticles.htm
>
>At Sun, 22 Sep 2002, Red wrote:
>>
>>Reposted this with a new title Thanks! Hi I am 27 years old hypothyroid
>>and diagnosed PCOS (finally last month). I have a history of
>>hypoglycemia (as low as 40's which at one point sent me to hospital). My
>>infertility doc had a fasting glucose and fasting insulin drawn and they
>>say I am not IR, and therefore, despite my array of symptoms I am not
>>eligible for metformin. I don't see how that is possible when I was
>>told that I was "overreleasing insulin" years ago before the PCOS
>>diagnosis. Do I need the 5 hour IGTT??? Is it possible this weekend
>>when my husband and I were away that my not taking my thyroid meds (so
>>hard to remember when they are packed in a suitcase) and restarting my
>>meds the morning of testing could have caused my insulin/glucose to be
>>screwy?? Also I am in the first weeks of a thyroid med increase! I was
>>thinking I should be rechecked next month. My insulin was 9 and glucose
>>was 93 well above 4.5 ratio I have read about! I hope someone can help
>>me or share their experiences so I can stop crying - this is all so
>>hopeless when you are trying to get pregnant. Thanks for any and all
>>input!
>>
>>--
>>Red Roo
>>

--
Sincerely,
Barb C.



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