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Re: HELP NEEDED!!! - long reply

From: SusieQ (anonymous@obgyn.net)
Wed, 29 Aug 2001 19:34:28 -0500 (CDT)


I am sorry Celeste, I must respectfully disagree. Metformin is already difficult on the kidneys and adding a low carb regimine is not recommended by most diabetes/pcos specialists. Instead they recommend a National Diabetes Foundation diet. Since my RE specifically told me not to dip below 70 grams of carbs per day while taking Metformin, I hope you will not be offended if I stick with his recommendation.

This article outlines a professionals opinion about low carbing (under 50 grams per day): PCOS and DIET by Martha McKittrick, Registered Dietician, Certified Diabetes Educator, OBGYN.net Editorial Advisor, found here: http://www.obgyn.net/pcos/articles/pcos_and_diet_mckittrick.htm. She specifically recommends not to low carb for PCOSers.

Metformin is metabolized by the kidneys, and uric acid provides a source for kidney stones in a ketogenic/high protein diet, together they put the kidneys at risk. Our friend Paula has made a comment in support as well here: http://forums.obgyn.net/pcos/PCOS.0009/1384.html.

The National Institute of Diabetes & Digestive & Kidney Diseases says: "It overworks your kidneys, and can cause dehydration, headaches, and bad breath. It can also make you feel nauseous, tired, weak, and dizzy. A buildup of ketones in your blood (called ketosis) can cause your body to produce high levels of uric acid, which is a risk factor for gout (a painful swelling of the joints) and kidney stones. Ketosis can be very risky for pregnant women and people with diabetes.

By following a reduced-calorie diet that is well-balanced between carbohydrates, proteins, and fats, you will still lose weight--without hurting your body. You will also be more likely to keep the weight off." Found here: http://www.niddk.nih.gov/health/nutrit/pubs/myths/index.htm

Researchers are scrutinizing the kidneys need for carbohydrates and their importance in renal function. Another reason not to overwork your kidneys by denying them important carbs. Read the research, Renal Gluconeogenesis Its importance in human glucose homeostasis by John E. Gerich, MD, Christian Meyer, MD, Hans J. Woerle, MD and Michael Stumvoll, MD here: http://care.diabetesjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/24/2/382?maxtoshow=&HITS=10&hits=10&RESULTFORMAT=&fulltext=kidney+low+carbohydrate&searchid=999130068467_7=kidney+low+carbohydrate&searchid=999130068467_792&stored_search=&FIRSTINDEX=40

Another research article that implicates low-carb diets can increase "insulin resistence" called, "A possible mechanism of insulin resistance in the rat adipose cell with high-fat/low-carbohydrate feeding. Depletion of intracellular glucose transport systems" by PJ Hissin, E Karnieli, IA Simpson, LB Salans and SW Cushman found here: http://diabetes.diabetesjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/31/7/589?maxtoshow=&HITS=10&hits=10&RESULTFORMAT=&fulltext=kidney+low+carbohydrate&searchid=9991309762text=kidney+low+carbohydrate&searchid=999130976263_824&stored_search=&FIRSTINDEX=70

As you can see, I do not agree with low carbing COMBINED with Metformin...this is not an argument, nor an attack. I feel that everyone should have all the information necessary to make the correct decision for themselves. Personally I feel miserable on met and low carbing. I hope everyone taking insulin lowering medications will talk with their doc before starting any diet regimen. All our test results are different, and all our needs are different. Urban Legends are not my cup of tea; double-blind, placebo controlled studies are. Again, Randi, I urge you to talk with your doc about your test results and possible treatment options (including diets).

--
SusieQ

> >At Wed, 29 Aug 2001, SusieQ wrote: >> >Lowcarbing is definitely NOT an issue for your kidneys UNLESS you are >somebody who has existing kidney disease AND you fail to drink water >throughout the day. People with normal kidney function do not get >kidney trouble from Atkins or any other lowcarb plan. I searched and >searched the medical journals on this issue and there is nothing to >substantiate lowcarb causing kidney problems in healthy people. It's an >urban legend. > >That said, Weight Watchers was actually a lowcarb diet 40 years ago when >it was started, but now it is a lowfat diet based on the Food Pyramid >that puts carbohydrates as the thing that you should be eating the most >of each day. If you are insulin resistant, as I am, you will most >likely gain on this plan. Check out http://www.atkinsfriends.com for support >and fantastic info on any of the various lowcarb plans; there is sure to >be one that will work for you. There are lots of PCOSers there being >helped by carbo restriction; I have lost 48 lbs on it and have had my >cycle come back without any meds. This never happened when I lost >weight on other methods. It's thrilling not to have to use bcps to >cycle. I feel a lot better, too. I think that within a couple of weeks >of starting lowcarb you too will know for sure if it helps you (and I >think it quite possible that it could help you). And if you are not >happy with it, all you need to do is quit. BTW, my cholesterol went >from 307 on WW to 184 on Atkins. I'm pleased about that too! > >>Hi Randi, >> >>I think you definitely need to talk with your pcos specialist about your >>tests and physical symptoms. Low carbing is hard on the kidneys and is >>not recommended when taking met. However, there are some things you can >>discuss with your doc. The first is increasing your met dosage...the >>upper dosing limits are 2000 - 2500mgs a day. Second is your test >>results. It is possible that the met no longer works for you. This >>does happen to some people. The next choice would be to do a >>combination therapy with another insulin sensitiser, or switching >>medications entirely. With the met, your results should be improving. >>Has there been any improvement between your results before starting met, >>and the recent results? You have a lot to talk about with your doc. I >>hope he/she can give you some guidance, IMVVHO. >> >>luck and love, SusieQ >> >>>I just increase my Glucophage to 2000mg (1000mg 2x a day) from 1700mg >>>(850mg 2x a day). DO you think I will feel any difference with the >>>300mg increase? I'm assuming no, but thought I'd ask. >>> >>>Also, I as very upset about something and hoping you guys can help. I >>>was eating pretty badly for a while, and decided to get my act together >>>and start to eat healthy. I joined Weight Watchers and lost only 1.6 >>>pounds the first week. I went yesterday to find out that I gained back >>>1.2 pounds...I don't understand. I am positive that my eating structure >>>changed for the better ...I have been on Glucophange for over a year...I >>>had lost about 20 pounds at the beginning...I have since gained it back. >>>I am afraid that I am not going to lose anything this time...I have 100 >>>to lose! >>>In addition, I am somewhat depressed and my hormones (of course) are >>>flying all over the place...I cry at the stupidist things. >>> >>>Can you guys give me some advice? My most recent bloodwork from a few >>>weeks ago is shitty... >>> >>>Fasting insulin -> 42.3 >>>Glucose -> 104 >>>Cholesterol-> 329 (i know...horrible) >>>Triglicerides -> 419 (i know also) >>> >>>Please tell me what I am doing wrong. I have loved this site for well >>>over a year and look to you guys for support. > >-- >Celeste >




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