Re: OB didelphyic/bicornuate and breech --> type of incision?
From: verner nellsch (vnellsch@eastex.net)
Tue Jul 29 19:47:20 2008
boy, oh, boy. i was welcomed to this list with the warning that you needed a
thick skin. it might have even been you who wrote that. seems like you can
dish it out, steve, but can't take it. you and eberhard don't seem to
contribute much to this list except sour criticism and insults. to accuse me
of ad hominem arguments is the pot calling the kettle black.
tell you what, i'll lay off you and eberhard and stick to the medicine if
you lay off me, and actually contribute some actual expertise and knowledge.
i'm a counter-puncher, and you guys are all too easy to paste some on.
i have a reason for not using capitals, and wearing nikes. if we get along
for awhile, maybe i will share it with you.
i await your next missive. vnellsch
>----- Original Message -----
From: "Raymond Stephen" <Stephen.Raymond@dhhs.tas.gov.au>
To: "Multiple recipients of list OB-GYN-L" <ob-gyn-l@mail.obgyn.net>
Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 6:27 PM
Subject: Re: OB didelphyic/bicornuate and breech --> type of incision?
> It seemed that this thread was degenerating so far into an "ad hominem"
> argument that no further replies would be warranted, but I can't ignore
> your stated wish that you "...would place my money on the practitioner
> who openly looks at all the different techniques, and uses the best..."
> because this is exactly what I am advocating. The best incision in
> obstetrics is the transverse and there are almost no indications for the
> midline. There, I said it again. If you are thinking of doing a
> midline I maintain you should be asking yourself why. I may be a
> nincompoop, but I believe it serves the patient best.
>
> As to the difference between "evisceration and "dehiscence" you can't
> have the former without the latter, and it is accepted jargon for
> "exenteration". When you have seen enough dehiscences you will know
> that evisceration is a common complication that would be disastrous to
> miss.
>
> Since you feel it reasonable to make personal attacks during a medical
> discussion; Nike wearers are mindless followers of the herd who lack
> perception of independent thinking, and are certainly not the type who,
> to use your own words, "... openly looks at all the different
> techniques, and uses the best, not just what he believes is advocated
> elsewhere." Rather they are guilty of, again to use your own words,
> "staying on what they consider the right side of any fashion."
>
> Failing to use any capitals in written communication is another example
> of this. Since when did professionals with a university education feel
> it satisfactory to adopt the slum habits of the ill-educated cell phone
> generation?
>
> Steve Raymond
> Ph (03)62227898
> Cell 0438372395
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ob-gyn-l@obgyn.net [mailto:ob-gyn-l@obgyn.net] On Behalf Of verner
> nellsch
> Sent: Wednesday, 30 July 2008 8:18 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list OB-GYN-L
> Subject: Re: OB didelphyic/bicornuate and breech --> type of incision?
>
> eberhard,
>
> i have met my share of department heads who are nincompoops, and
> experienced
> at the politics of department management, and staying on what they
> consider
> the right side of any fashion in medicine. as for what he writes being
> true,
> time will tell. i would place my money on the practitioner who openly
> looks
> at all the different techniques, and uses the best, not just what he
> believes is advocated elsewhere. as for what he writes being gospel, do
> you
> really want to get into comparing what he writes and the veracity of
> scripture?
>
> as for nonsense, do you know the difference between a dehiscence and
> evisceration? one means a disrupted suture line, the other removal of
> the
> intestines. before lecturing someone as being informed or not, eberhard,
> get
> your terms straight. you appear to have delusions of adequacy. people
> let
> you get by with a lot because you are somewhat amusing, but a fair
> amount of
> what you spout off is nothing but narrow minded drivel. you at times are
>
> insulting, and the internet informs me, accused of slander as well. i
> appreciate your directness in confronting possible poseurs on the site,
> and
> i am sure there is much that you could teach all of us, minus the
> attitude.
>
> am i experienced? i delivered my first baby in 1975. i have been in
> medicine
> constantly ever since. i wear nikes. and i have telinde 9th edition.
> vnellsch
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dr Eberhard W Lisse" <el@lisse.na>
> To: "Multiple recipients of list OB-GYN-L" <ob-gyn-l@mail.obgyn.net>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 12:43 AM
> Subject: Re: OB didelphyic/bicornuate and breech --> type of incision?
>
>> Verner,
>>
>> he was the head of a huge department in South Africa and now is the
>> head of a teaching institution in Australia. He's one of two
> contributors
>> to the list I have actually met. He has the actual experience and what
> he
>> writes is true, aka gospel.
>>
>> And what you are writing below is nonsense. A Senior Registrar, aka
>> Chief Resident (but with a Specialist qualification) gets to do things
>
>> like
>> fixing eviscerated bowel. He did didn't write his Consultant
> (Attending)
>> did the vertical against Steve's advice. I have fixed my fair share of
>> evisceration (usually a combination of vertical incision and Cuban
> Quack)
>> as well. Being a sub-specialist (Onc) doesn't meant your choice of
>> incision is right, by default.
>>
>> You on the other hand come over as someone less than informed and/or
>> experienced. Do you run around in boots?
>>
>> greetings, el
>>
>> On 28 Jul 2008, at 23:25 , verner nellsch wrote:
>>
>>> eberhard,
>>>
>>> steve comes across as a humorless, tedious pedant. he uses
> statistics
>>> like a drunk uses lamp posts, for support, not illumination. he
>>> insinuates that he was smarter and more capable than his attendings
> as a
>>> "senior registrar", and more discerning than his consultant gyn
>>> oncologist. i have not once seen him allow for any other way than
> his
>>> preferred way as being acceptable. i have never once seen him offer
>>> comfort for someone on the list when they present with problems,
> only
>>> criticism, and barbed at that. he is dull, and makes others dull for
>
>>> fear of getting one of his responses.
>>>
>>> so, to use your phrase, i could give a toss as to the person with
> whom i
>>> am dealing. it does not matter who the bag of hot air is, they need
>>> deflating.
>>>
>>> but, perhaps i have misjudged the individual. please enlighten me as
> to
>>> why i should hold him in greater esteem, greater than he seems to
> hold
>>> anyone else. vnellsch
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dr Eberhard W Lisse"
> <el@lisse.na>
>>> To: "Multiple recipients of list OB-GYN-L" <ob-gyn-l@mail.obgyn.net>
>>> Sent: Monday, July 28, 2008 1:02 PM
>>> Subject: Re: OB didelphyic/bicornuate and breech --> type of
> incision?
>>>
>>>> Verner,
>>>>
>>>> It's fairly obvious that you haven't got a clue who you are dealing
>>>> with...
>>>>
>>>> el
>>>>
>>>> On 28 Jul 2008, at 12:10 , verner nellsch wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> you spent" much of your time" fixing burst abdomens. i've told you
> a
>>>>> million times to never exaggerate.
>>>>>
>>>>> i use a mix of transverse and midline incisions, with good
> success. i
>>>>> think that a flexible approach to the abdomen is the best.
>>>>>
>>>>> you do not. oh,well. vnellsch
>>>
>>
>
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