Re: qualifications
From: Anna Meenan, MD (annam@uic.edu)
Tue May 31 22:29:55 2005
And here in the heart of the Midwest, it's coconut rum in that new lime
Coke, with Orville Reddenbacker's Sweet and Buttery popcorn (and 40 mg
of famotidine).
--
Anna Meenan, MD (watching a chick flick with my daughter)
At Tue, 31 May 2005, Charlie Chambers wrote:
>
>--Apple-Mail-1--302939959
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset=US-ASCII;
> delsp=yes;
> format=flowed
>
>Well said Dr. J. The strawberries sound great but I'll go with Pacific
>Northwest Salmon, and a glass of amber ale from the local brewery.
>Vive' le difference (sp?)
>
>************************************************************************
>**
>
>--
>************************************************************************
>Charlie Chambers
>Hood River, OR USA
>cchamber@alumni. rice. edu
>
>"I'm a goin fishin.
>Yeah, I'm goin fishin
>And my baby's goin fishin too!"
> Taj Mahal
>
>************************************************************************
>On May 31, 2005, at 6:21 PM, DoctorJoe@aol.com wrote:
>************************************************************************
>
>> In a message dated 5/31/05 6:48:38 PM, jane.wines@telus.net writes:
>>
>>> Since when were the only proffessionals OB's?
>>> 70% of women in the UK and higher in some other countries have
>>> midwives and
>>> never see Drs and the mortality and morbidity is lower than in the
>>> US. OB's
>>> should be saved for high risk and complications only.
>>> Hoping to goodness that you are just winding everyone up and not for
>>> real.
>>
>> Wait, wait, wait! We're drifting into apples and oranges yet again.
>>
>> 1) OB's are not the ONLY "professionals." Seems to me that anyone who
>> does anything for money is a "professional." So from the "oldest
>> profession" on, anyone performing some function for a living is a
>> "professional."
>>
>> 1) (A) I believe the original question concerned doulas and it
>> implied some doubt as to whether they were qualified in the debate on
>> mode/choice/whatever of obstetric care. My information tells me that
>> doulas are emotional/physical supporters of labor which, without more,
>> does not qualify them to expertly opine regarding conduct of labor in
>> a medical discussion (e.g. between OBs, midwives, MFMs). Doubtless
>> doulas are "professional" if they accept money for their services.
>>
>> 2) Comparisons of maternal and perinatal mortality statistics is
>> fraught with difficulty due to different populations, different
>> population heterogeneity, different statistical methods from country
>> to country, and the like. Suffice it to say that, utilizing the chart
>> under discussion, we'd all feel safer saying that Singapore has much
>> better midwife/OB care than the U.K, right? Of course not!
>>
>> 3) The philosophy of 'saving' physicians only for complicated cases
>> is just that, a philosophy, and is based on numerous factors
>> (tradition, availability, etc.) which differ from country to country
>> and even within countries. The argument so far seems to be "My way is
>> better because it is better! So there!" It's correct to say "My way is
>> different because it's different."
>>
>> 4) Finally, El IS, in fact, for real. What most of "you people" (I
>> LOVE that term! It's so politically incorrect!) miss is the fact that
>> El steadfastly stands by HIS philosophy and refuses to be pushed
>> around by emotionalism. If you show him facts, he will listen. I wager
>> you won't be able to show him many appropriate facts, because of (3)
>> and (2) above.
>>
>> Anyway, I'm tired of apples and oranges. We just got a flat of great
>> Louisiana strawberries (MUCH better, by the way, than the California
>> strawberries which show up on the grocery shelves down here) and I'm
>> going to get some and have them with my Chardonnay (and yes, it's
>> Australian Chardonnay, Mate).
>>
>> Cheers!
>>
>> Joe P.
>>
>--Apple-Mail-1--302939959
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>Content-Type: text/enriched;
> charset=US-ASCII
>
><fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>Well said Dr. J. The
>strawberries sound great but I'll go with Pacific Northwest Salmon,
>and a glass of amber ale from the local brewery. Vive' le difference
>(sp?)
>
></fontfamily>
>
><fontfamily><param>Helvetica</param>**************************************************************************
>
><fontfamily><param>Helvetica</param>**************************************************************************
>Charlie Chambers
>
>Hood River, OR USA
>
>cchamber@alumni. rice. edu
>
>"I'm a goin fishin.
>
>Yeah, I'm goin fishin
>
>And my baby's goin fishin too!"
>
> Taj Mahal
>
>************************************************************************</fontfamily>
>
>************************************************************************</fontfamily>
><fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>On</fontfamily>
><fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>May</fontfamily> 31, 2005,
><fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>at</fontfamily> 6:21
><fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>PM</fontfamily>,
><fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>DoctorJoe@aol</fontfamily>.<fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>com</fontfamily>
><fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>wrote</fontfamily>:
>
><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Geneva</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> In a message
>dated 5/31/05 6:48:38 PM, jane.wines@telus.net writes:</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><excerpt><fontfamily><param>Geneva</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Since
>when were the only proffessionals OB's?</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt></excerpt><excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Geneva</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> 70% of women
>in the UK and higher in some other countries have midwives and</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt></excerpt><excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Geneva</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> never see
>Drs and the mortality and morbidity is lower than in the US. OB's</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt></excerpt><excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Geneva</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> should be
>saved for high risk and complications only.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt></excerpt><excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Geneva</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> Hoping to
>goodness that you are just winding everyone up and not for real.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt></excerpt><excerpt><excerpt>
>
></excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Geneva</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> Wait, wait,
>wait! We're drifting into apples and oranges yet again.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Geneva</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> 1) OB's are
>not the ONLY "professionals." Seems to me that anyone who does
>anything for money is a "professional." So from the "oldest
>profession" on, anyone performing some function for a living is a
>"professional."</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Geneva</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> 1) (A) I
>believe the original question concerned doulas and it implied some
>doubt as to whether they were qualified in the debate on
>mode/choice/whatever of obstetric care. My information tells me that
>doulas are emotional/physical supporters of labor which, without more,
>does not qualify them to expertly opine regarding conduct of labor in
>a medical discussion (e.g. between OBs, midwives, MFMs). Doubtless
>doulas are "professional" if they accept money for their services. </x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Geneva</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> 2)
>Comparisons of maternal and perinatal mortality statistics is fraught
>with difficulty due to different populations, different population
>heterogeneity, different statistical methods from country to country,
>and the like. Suffice it to say that, utilizing the chart under
>discussion, we'd all feel safer saying that Singapore has much better
>midwife/OB care than the U.K, right? Of course not!</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Geneva</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> 3) The
>philosophy of 'saving' physicians only for complicated cases is just
>that, a philosophy, and is based on numerous factors (tradition,
>availability, etc.) which differ from country to country and even
>within countries. The argument so far seems to be "My way is better
>because it is better! So there!" It's correct to say "My way is
>different because it's different." </x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Geneva</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> 4) Finally,
>El IS, in fact, for real. What most of "you people" (I LOVE that term!
>It's so politically incorrect!) miss is the fact that El steadfastly
>stands by HIS philosophy and refuses to be pushed around by
>emotionalism. If you show him facts, he will listen. I wager you won't
>be able to show him many appropriate facts, because of (3) and (2)
>above. </x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Geneva</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> Anyway, I'm
>tired of apples and oranges. We just got a flat of great Louisiana
>strawberries (MUCH better, by the way, than the California
>strawberries which show up on the grocery shelves down here) and I'm
>going to get some and have them with my Chardonnay (and yes, it's
>Australian Chardonnay, Mate).</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Geneva</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> Cheers!</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Geneva</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> Joe P.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
></excerpt>
>--Apple-Mail-1--302939959--
>
