Re: sponses: Does it matter how the baby is born?(long)
From: Efrain Ramirez (eramirezt@coqui.net)
Sun May 22 23:30:19 2005
I don't waste my time anymore on the VBAC issue - it's dead issue -
killed by patients and lawyers - mostly for money ...as simple as that..
>At Sun, 22 May 2005, Charlie Chambers wrote:
>
>--Apple-Mail-3-1028151327
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset=ISO-8859-1;
> delsp=yes;
> format=flowed
>
>As I've stated on this forum in the past, unless people are willing to
>share in the risk why would any of us be willing to put our career at
>risk? Patients and lawyers have put us in the unenviable position of
>defensive medicine. I'll also admit that a number of colleagues have
>certainly assisted by testifying against each other. The one aspect
>that has not been covered in the discussions of "medical malpractice
>crisis" is the career ending nature of lawsuits. A single lawsuit now
>has the ability to force any one of us out of a profession that we have
>committed significant effort. I think those 3 respondents have some
>very valid points. However, who would be willing to take a 1 in 100
>"crap shoot" that the next VBAC that they attend will end their career?
>
>************************************************************************
>****
>************************************************************************
>
>--
>Charlie Chambers
>Hood River, OR USA
>cchamber@alumni.rice.edu
>
>"...not because I regard fishing as being so terribly
>important but because I suspect that so many of the other
>concerns of men are equally unimportant-and not nearly
>so much fun."
> John Voelker
>************************************************************************
>*****
>************************************************************************
>On May 22, 2005, at 7:55 AM, Stmidwife@aol.com wrote:
>
>>
>> Here are some responses, I from some of the people at the
>> perinatal pysch center in Santa Barbara, not sure which one, I posted
>> to two facilities. There were 3 responses as of yesterday.
>>
>> Response #1
>>
>> Let me compare my c-section and my VBAC. 24 hours
>> after my c-section, they took out my catheter so I
>> could go to the bathroom. I was in tears because it
>> hurt so much when I had to go, but I had to ring the
>> nurse (threee times) and wait for her to come and help
>> me get out of bed (first I gave myself two pumps of
>> morphine so that I could handle the pain of getting
>> out of bed). I almost past out on the toilet and two
>> nurses had to give me smelling salts repeatedly. Then
>> they had to help me get back in bed. One hour after my
>> vaginal birth, I had to go to the bathroom, and I got
>> up (all by myself), walked to the bathroom by myself
>> and did my thing.
>>
>> Five days after my c-section, my parents were fixing
>> dinner for me and I thought I'd help make a salad. I
>> was up for 10 minutes to toss the salad and the pain
>> was too much so I had to sit down. Four days after my
>> VBAC, it was too hot to sit at home so we took the
>> kids to the mall, walked around for two hours, let my
>> 2-year old daughter play at the playground, and the
>> only part that was uncomfortable was having to go to
>> the bathroom without my peri bottle.
>>
>> I think it's great that he has patients that are
>> "fully functional" after 36 hours. I didn't feel
>> "fully functional" for over a month after my
>> c-section.
>>
>> But pain goes away. The lasting impact is the way I
>> felt about both births, which is dramatically
>> different. I never felt that I "gave birth" to my
>> daughter. Instead, I had an operation and came home
>> with a baby.
>>
>> Response #2
>>
>> Well that depends.
>> Obviously the most important thing is that baby and mom are healthy
>> and baby has a safe arrival but why subject a mom to MAJOR SURGERY
>> (c/s) if it is not warrented?
>> Vaginal births are natural and are the INTENDED delivery method. Our
>> bodies were designed for this. To have a c/s out of convienence is
>> ridiculous.
>> Also how about all the moms who want to have a vaginal birth.
>> This is a gift to us. Something only us women can experience so why
>> shouldn't we?
>> I felt extremely cheated after my c/s. I felt I missed out on some
>> great secret that woman for eons have experienced.
>> It wasn't until I went on to have a succesfull vbac that I felt
>> fulfilled in my birthing experience.
>> Saying the delivery method is overated is absurd. Healing time for a
>> c/s is longer than a vaginal birth. I know this because I've had both.
>> I think it's sad that obgyn's and hospitals are not only pressuring
>> moms to have c/s but allowing them to believe that it's easier or that
>> it doesn't really matter how baby is born.
>> Aside from being major surgery, I'm sure you can agree that c/s can
>> cause many other complications.
>> How about the fact that you will be away from your baby for hours to
>> possibly one or two days. What about the fact that you can't nurse
>> immediately after birth? What about the woman who can't bf for several
>> days and their babies end up being supplemented with formula by well
>> meaning hospital staff and then baby won't take the breast?
>> Breastfeeding is the best possibly nutrition for baby, why would you
>> want to risk it?
>> I'm not saying that if it's a high risk pregnancy or there is other
>> forseeable complications that a c/s isn't optimal but in a normal
>> pregnancy a c/s is not the route to go.
>> In my opinion there are far too many dr's these days using scare
>> tactics to push moms into c/s's and In my opinion I think said dr's
>> are getting a little upset that more mom's are arming themselves with
>> knowledge and sticking to their guns instead of caving in to said
>> scare tactics.
>>
>> Reponse #3
>>
>>
>> First of all I think physical health is whats
>> overated. Physical health means very little if your
>> emotional and mental health are lagging far behind. I
>> would rather be missing an arm and be emotionally
>> sound and whole than have a perfect body and be an
>> emotional basket case on prosac.
>> Even for those who don't agree with the previous
>> statement, emotional issues can greatly effect
>> physical health.
>> Also the baby and mother are hormonally and physically
>> wired to be healthier when their birthing and bonding
>> needs are met. These needs are not very complex or
>> dificult to accomodate - and I really have a hard time
>> seeing what the big PROBLEM is in respecting and
>> honoring those needs.
>> They need to be respected as people and individuals
>> with rights, choices, and voices
>> They need to be together, not seperated
>> They both need to be recognized as owners of their own
>> bodies, and be respected as such, not to be pushed
>> around or ignored, handled carlessly or casually, or
>> coerced
>> They need their privacy and dignity to be respected
>> and honored by their caregivers
>>
>> These are very simple and sensible things, that do not
>> cost anything but a moment of pause and consideration
>> from their caregivers. Unless one has a god complex I
>> really don't see the objection to "allowing" basic
>> human rights during a natural process.
>>
>> Regarding VBAC and homebirth. It's the OB's and
>> Hospitals and insurance companies own doings that move
>> many women to these "extremes". If a woman knows she
>> is likely to get what she wants/needs at home but not
>> at the hospital where do you THINK she is going to
>> give birth.
>> I think that the medical profession ignores to some
>> extent the psychological aspects of childbirth
>> especially the way c-sections and forceps/vacuum
>> deliveries affect a womans self image, and perception
>> of her body.
>> Most women feel like they have lost something when
>> they are not able (by reason or fault) to give birth
>> naturally. As a woman who has given birth at home
>> without drugs (and it was a long painful labor mind
>> you), I must say that I would be a totally different
>> person if I had not given birth in the way I chose. I
>> would have a different profession, different parenting
>> style, different relationships with my son and my
>> spouse, and I don't beleive I would be as happy. Birth
>> is the beginning of a lot of change for everyone
>> involved. The tone of the event will resonate on the
>> lives of the family for at least 6 months after the
>> birth and will affect in no small way alot of what
>> they do and how they do it.
>> I am rather appauled at the way these issues are
>> dismissed so lightly by womens care providers. "first
>> do no harm" eh?
>> Faith
>>
>>
>--Apple-Mail-3-1028151327
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>Content-Type: text/enriched;
> charset=ISO-8859-1
>
><fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>As I've stated on this forum
>in the past, unless people are willing to share in the risk why would
>any of us be willing to put our career at risk? Patients and lawyers
>have put us in the unenviable position of defensive medicine. I'll
>also admit that a number of colleagues have certainly assisted by
>testifying against each other. The one aspect that has not been
>covered in the discussions of "medical malpractice crisis" is the
>career ending nature of lawsuits. A single lawsuit now has the ability
>to force any one of us out of a profession that we have committed
>significant effort. I think those 3 respondents have some very valid
>points. However, who would be willing to take a 1 in 100 "crap shoot"
>that the next VBAC that they attend will end their career?
>
></fontfamily>
>
>><fontfamily><param>Helvetica</param>************************************* **************************************
>
><fontfamily><param>Helvetica</param>************************************* **************************************
>Charlie Chambers
>
>Hood River, OR USA
>
>cchamber@alumni.rice.edu
>
>"...not because I regard fishing as being so terribly
>
>important but because I suspect that so many of the other
>
>concerns of men are equally unimportant-and not nearly
>
>so much fun."
>
> John Voelker
>
>>************************************************************************* ***</fontfamily>
>
>************************************************************************* ***</fontfamily>
><fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>On</fontfamily>
><fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>May</fontfamily> 22, 2005,
><fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>at</fontfamily> 7:55
><fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>AM</fontfamily>,
><fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>Stmidwife@aol</fontfamily>.<fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>com</fontfamily>
><fontfamily><param>Lucida Grande</param>wrote</fontfamily>:
>
><excerpt>
>
>><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> </x-tad-smalle ></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Here are some
>responses, I from some of the people at the perinatal pysch center in
>Santa Barbara, not sure which one, I posted to two facilities.
>There were 3 responses as of yesterday.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
>><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> </x-tad-smalle ></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
>><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> </x-tad-smalle ></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Response #1</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Let me compare
>my c-section and my VBAC. 24 hours</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>after my
>c-section, they took out my catheter so I</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>could go to
>the bathroom. I was in tears because it</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>hurt so much
>when I had to go, but I had to ring the</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>nurse (threee
>times) and wait for her to come and help</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>me get out of
>bed (first I gave myself two pumps of</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>morphine so
>that I could handle the pain of getting</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>out of bed). I
>almost past out on the toilet and two</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>nurses had to
>give me smelling salts repeatedly. Then</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>they had to
>help me get back in bed. One hour after my</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>vaginal birth,
>I had to go to the bathroom, and I got</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>up (all by
>myself), walked to the bathroom by myself</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>and did my
>thing.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Five days
>after my c-section, my parents were fixing</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>dinner for me
>and I thought I'd help make a salad. I</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>was up for 10
>minutes to toss the salad and the pain</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>was too much
>so I had to sit down. Four days after my</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>VBAC, it was
>too hot to sit at home so we took the</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>kids to the
>mall, walked around for two hours, let my</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>2-year old
>daughter play at the playground, and the</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>only part that
>was uncomfortable was having to go to</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>the bathroom
>without my peri bottle. </x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>I think it's
>great that he has patients that are</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>"fully
>functional" after 36 hours. I didn't feel</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>"fully
>functional" for over a month after my</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
>><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>c-section.</x-tad smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>But pain goes
>away. The lasting impact is the way I</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>felt about
>both births, which is dramatically</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>different. I
>never felt that I "gave birth" to my</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>daughter.
>Instead, I had an operation and came home</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>with a baby.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
>><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> </x-tad-smalle ></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Response #2</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
>><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> </x-tad-smalle ></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Well that
>depends.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Obviously the
>most important thing is that baby and mom are healthy and baby has a
>safe arrival but why subject a mom to MAJOR SURGERY (c/s) if it is not
>warrented?</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Vaginal births
>are natural and are the INTENDED delivery method. Our bodies were
>designed for this. To have a c/s out of convienence is ridiculous.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Also how about
>all the moms who want to have a vaginal birth.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>This is a gift
>to us. Something only us women can experience so why shouldn't we?</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>I felt
>extremely cheated after my c/s. I felt I missed out on some great
>secret that woman for eons have experienced.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>It wasn't
>until I went on to have a succesfull vbac that I felt fulfilled in my
>birthing experience.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Saying the
>delivery method is overated is absurd. Healing time for a c/s is
>longer than a vaginal birth. I know this because I've had both.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>I think it's
>sad that obgyn's and hospitals are not only pressuring moms to have
>c/s but allowing them to believe that it's easier or that it doesn't
>really matter how baby is born.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Aside from
>being major surgery, I'm sure you can agree that c/s can cause many
>other complications.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>How about the
>fact that you will be away from your baby for hours to possibly one or
>two days. What about the fact that you can't nurse immediately after
>birth? What about the woman who can't bf for several days and their
>babies end up being supplemented with formula by well meaning
>hospital staff and then baby won't take the breast?</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Breastfeeding
>is the best possibly nutrition for baby, why would you want to risk it?</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>I'm not saying
>that if it's a high risk pregnancy or there is other forseeable
>complications that a c/s isn't optimal but in a normal pregnancy a c/s
>is not the route to go.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>In my opinion
>there are far too many dr's these days using scare tactics to push
>moms into c/s's and In my opinion I think said dr's are getting a
>little upset that more mom's are arming themselves with knowledge and
>sticking to their guns instead of caving in to said scare tactics.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
>><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> </x-tad-smalle ></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Reponse #3</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
>><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> </x-tad-smalle ></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>First of all I
>think physical health is whats</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>overated.
>Physical health means very little if your</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>emotional and
>mental health are lagging far behind. I</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>would rather
>be missing an arm and be emotionally</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>sound and
>whole than have a perfect body and be an</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>emotional
>basket case on prosac. </x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Even for those
>who don't agree with the previous</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>statement,
>emotional issues can greatly effect</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>physical
>health. </x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Also the baby
>and mother are hormonally and physically</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>wired to be
>healthier when their birthing and bonding</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>needs are met.
>These needs are not very complex or</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>dificult to
>accomodate - and I really have a hard time</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>seeing what
>the big PROBLEM is in respecting and</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>honoring those
>needs.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>They need to
>be respected as people and individuals</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>with rights,
>choices, and voices</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>They need to
>be together, not seperated</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>They both need
>to be recognized as owners of their own</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>bodies, and be
>respected as such, not to be pushed</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>around or
>ignored, handled carlessly or casually, or</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
>><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>coerced</x-tad-sm ller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>They need
>their privacy and dignity to be respected</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>and honored by
>their caregivers </x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>These are very
>simple and sensible things, that do not</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>cost anything
>but a moment of pause and consideration</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>from their
>caregivers. Unless one has a god complex I</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>really don't
>see the objection to "allowing" basic</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>human rights
>during a natural process.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Regarding VBAC
>and homebirth. It's the OB's and</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Hospitals and
>insurance companies own doings that move</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>many women to
>these "extremes". If a woman knows she</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>is likely to
>get what she wants/needs at home but not</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>at the
>hospital where do you THINK she is going to</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>give birth. </x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>I think that
>the medical profession ignores to some</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>extent the
>psychological aspects of childbirth</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>especially the
>way c-sections and forceps/vacuum</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>deliveries
>affect a womans self image, and perception</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>of her body. </x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Most women
>feel like they have lost something when</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>they are not
>able (by reason or fault) to give birth</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>naturally. As
>a woman who has given birth at home</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>without drugs
>(and it was a long painful labor mind</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>you), I must
>say that I would be a totally different</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>person if I
>had not given birth in the way I chose. I</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>would have a
>different profession, different parenting</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>style,
>different relationships with my son and my</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>spouse, and I
>don't beleive I would be as happy. Birth</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>is the
>beginning of a lot of change for everyone</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>involved. The
>tone of the event will resonate on the</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>lives of the
>family for at least 6 months after the</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>birth and will
>affect in no small way alot of what</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>they do and
>how they do it.</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>I am rather
>appauled at the way these issues are</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>dismissed so
>lightly by womens care providers. "first</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>do no harm" eh?</x-tad-smaller></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
>><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller>Faith</x-tad-smal er></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
>><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> </x-tad-smalle ></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><excerpt>
>
>><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller><x-tad-smaller> </x-tad-smalle ></smaller></fontfamily></excerpt
>--Apple-Mail-3-1028151327--
>
--
I think I will do nothing for a long time but listen,
And accrue what I hear into myself...and let sounds
contribute toward me.
~walt whitman~
